2018 Rule Change Discussion

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Hey guys sorry to burst your bubble , i DO NOT want to give up my number , my race bike and dirtbike hockey numbers have all been #2 i have invested good money into full race numbers and the bike isnt getting remodeled or changed over the winter so the bike will be the same . Im hoping u understand my point of view , nothing against ray steel or the club :)
 

S-african

Member
Regarding going to full qualifying times for grids...
For those classes where the grids are done on a championship point basis, I understand it is manual, but those points situations are known weeks before race weekend, so they could then be done at leisure in the weeks leading up to race weekend, meaning less needs to be done on race weekend (less grids), or am i missing something...or is it just that big a pain to do the manual classes entries on points.
 

blam

Administrator
That's actually not true the earliest that can be done is the Thursday before a race weekend. Otherwise you end up with empty spots because people don't show up or decided not to register for that race and then you might have new entrance that are coming in that didn't previously race. The exact have enough to do on a Friday and Saturday they don't really have time to sit down and dogrid sheets for 2 or 3 hours on the Friday or Saturday
 
Ps: on the #2 aswell ....how would ray feel if he had to change numbers twice in 2 years cause one for #2 then once again for another number the year after ..... just saying
 

Scopro

New Member
Yes. I like the proposal with #1 as it puts the onus back on the rider as it should be to have their bikes prepared properly.
Tech is merely there for a quick once over to make sure nothing that is easily visible has been missed.
#2 is another great idea if tosh is willing to relinquish his current number
My proposed changes.

#1. Technical infractions having some sort of fine system. Where the fine issued would be in the form of points. This is not with things caught during tech, this is referring to things after the fact, or things tech can't readily check. Eg: If somebody is caught running antifreeze in their radiator, they forfeit all points from that weekend.

#2. This one would be based on Tosh being OK with it (if voted in). But I think that the Black #2 should be reserved for the Intermediate Superbike Champ, just as the Black #1 is reserved for the expert Superbike Champ. I think it would be nice for someone to have that year long recognition after such an accomplishment.

Edit: This is a big one, and I'm surprised I forgot it.

#3. I propose that all bikes (that have one available) are to run a full bellypan with no drain holes (unless plugged). This means that even if the vent lines are into the (350ml+) catch can, that a fully closed in belly pan is still required. Sure there will be some naked bikes that are excluded from this rule, but if your bike has one that is available, then you must have one to pass tech. I think anybody that was there and helped with the cleanup on the Friday before the final double header would agree with this. The cleanup would have been a fraction of what it was if the bike had an enclosed belly pan. Yes I know it was a "track day" as well, but the bike that caused it was an EMRA racer's race bike...


One vote for #3. It is because of #3 that we should have #1. There was also a very close call on the last race weekend, Brian caught it first luckily

#2 Tosh should keep #2, it's his trademark.
Good idea though for having an Intermediate Champ going for a Blue number. Blue V.S. Blue would be an awesome race! Call it 2.5 or whatever but it would make an awesome race to see the up-and-coming Intermediate go against the Champion.
 

Goatse

Active Member
Hey guys sorry to burst your bubble , i DO NOT want to give up my number , my race bike and dirtbike hockey numbers have all been #2 i have invested good money into full race numbers and the bike isnt getting remodeled or changed over the winter so the bike will be the same . Im hoping u understand my point of view , nothing against ray steel or the club :)

All good Tosh. It's why before even bringing it up, I said the condition was on you. I didn't know if you were, or weren't attached to the #2 or not (some guys just pick single digits because they look cool).

But it would be cool to recognize the Intermediate Champs, so I'll think of something else.
 

Goatse

Active Member
One vote for #3. It is because of #3 that we should have #1. There was also a very close call on the last race weekend, Brian caught it first luckily

#2 Tosh should keep #2, it's his trademark.
Good idea though for having an Intermediate Champ going for a Blue number. Blue V.S. Blue would be an awesome race! Call it 2.5 or whatever but it would make an awesome race to see the up-and-coming Intermediate go against the Champion.

We already have the Blue #1 (well a white 1 on a blue background) for the Blue Plate Championship. So I don't think a blue number (or another number 1 in any color for that matter) is the best route.
 

DEFBOY35

Well-Known Member
Ps: on the #2 aswell ....how would ray feel if he had to change numbers twice in 2 years cause one for #2 then once again for another number the year after ..... just saying
My suggestion would be that ray (intermediate sbk champion any year) would pick his new number for expert to reserve it. But run the black number 2 in the rookie expert season only. That way the number they choose is reserved. If a different number they wanted becomes available afterwards they can choose as always.

This wouldn't be setting any crazy president as far as how it's done elsewhere. There are some clubs in which the top 10 numbers are reserved for the top 10 experts every year to be earned. And they have the choice to run that number or not while reserving their usual number for the future if needed.
We are only suggesting to reserve the 2 numbers for the respective sbk champs. (Well dana is and anyone who agrees with him)
 
Appreciate the input in changing the number and all that jazz to make it known hes the inter champ but no one really pays attention to the number and what it mean , hell u cant even see the number beside the volunteers.
IF i do end up losing this battle which i hope i dont i would hope EMRA would fork over the money to replace my numbers with the exact set up i already have from who i got it from $$$
 

DEFBOY35

Well-Known Member
Appreciate the input in changing the number and all that jazz to make it known hes the inter champ but no one really pays attention to the number and what it mean , hell u cant even see the number beside the volunteers.
IF i do end up losing this battle which i hope i dont i would hope EMRA would fork over the money to replace my numbers with the exact set up i already have from who i got it from $$$
Well I think it's settled as you would like to
Keep your number. If that ever changes perhaps at that time we will implement it.
 

fast316

EMRA Executive Member
Lots of good input here.

Just a couple FYI's, there is no voting here, merely discussion for topics to be brought up at the AGM. You must show up at the AGM to vote. Since there is so much discussion on a number of different topics please be very thorough in your explanations, and please remember to use quotes when referring to someone else.
 

fast316

EMRA Executive Member
I'd like to propose changing PRACTICE DAY sessions from 12 minutes to 20 minutes.

The hope here is to better accommodate our larger rider numbers on track. At roughly 100 riders per round that leaves over 20+ riders in each group. At the fast end of the practice groups riders have to deal with the largest lap time disparity. At the slower end of the practice sessions riders have to deal with large numbers of rider on track at the same time. Rather than all the riders in each group going out at roughly the same time to get their 12 minute sessions in, riders could space themselves out throughout the 20 minute session. Those that just have to be out first thing can go out first thing, those that want to wait for a gap can wait. Everyone can still get roughly the same amount of actual time on track, but hopefully be spaced out better.

The down side to this is obviously 6 sessions throughout the day rather than 7. That being said the session time could be adjusted as the day goes on to accommodate time lost due to red flags, delays etc, as needed, just like we already do.
 

Goatse

Active Member
Appreciate the input in changing the number and all that jazz to make it known hes the inter champ but no one really pays attention to the number and what it mean , hell u cant even see the number beside the volunteers.
IF i do end up losing this battle which i hope i dont i would hope EMRA would fork over the money to replace my numbers with the exact set up i already have from who i got it from $$$

#1. This isn't about Ray. It has nothing to do with "Ray", as I barely know him. This is about recognizing all future Int SBK champs, and I would be suggesting this regardless who won Int SBK.

#2. As for your comment "no one really pays attention to the number and what it mean", I don't agree with that at all. Ask Zottman how proud he is to run the #1 plate. So once the precedent (not president, Shane) is set, that number would mean just as much as the Black #1 that Mike will again be running next year.

#3. If this is more about the cost of changing your numbers than the # actually meaning something to you, then I know I would gladly pitch in to help the club have something to recognize rider's achievements in all future seasons. The Expert Champ gets to proudly run the #1 on their bike, so it'd be nice for the Int Champs to have something similar to proudly run on theirs.
 
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DEFBOY35

Well-Known Member
#1. This isn't about Ray. It has nothing to do with "Ray", as I barely know him. This is about recognizing all future Int SBK champs, and I would be suggesting this regardless who won Int SBK.

#2. As for your comment "no one really pays attention to the number and what it mean", I don't agree with that at all. Ask Zottman how proud he is to run the #1 plate. So once the precedent (not president, Shane) is set, that number would mean just as much as the Black #1 that Mike will again be running next year.

#3. If this is more about the cost of changing your numbers than the # actually meaning something to you, then I know I would gladly pitch in to help the club have something to recognize rider's achievements in all future seasons. The Expert Champ gets to proudly run the #1 on their bike, so it'd be nice for the Int Champs to have something similar to proudly run on theirs.
Thank you for the correction. That is what I meant. Lol
 

Cdw46

Member
I would personally like to see qualifying for all classes for those of us that can't make it to every round.

The number 2 for int champ doesnt make sense to me. The champ didn't finish second, he finished first. The 600 champ and many other Champs don't get a special number. Including the winner of expert 600. I think tosh should get to keep his number without feeling guilty about it.
 

RamboRay

New Member
#1. This isn't about Ray. It has nothing to do with "Ray", as I barely know him. This is about recognizing all future Int SBK champs, and I would be suggesting this regardless who won Int SBK.

#2. As for your comment "no one really pays attention to the number and what it mean", I don't agree with that at all. Ask Zottman how proud he is to run the #1 plate. So once the precedent (not president, Shane) is set, that number would mean just as much as the Black #1 that Mike will again be running next year.

#3. If this is more about the cost of changing your numbers than the # actually meaning something to you, then I know I would gladly pitch in to help the club have something to recognize rider's achievements in all future seasons. The Expert Champ gets to proudly run the #1 on their bike, so it'd be nice for the Int Champs to have something similar to proudly run on theirs.

***Again, its not about "Ray" its about future Int. SBK Champs. Any old Black #'s would be fine with me. Dana, I do like the notion but Tosh has full right to keep his numbers and I can't blame him. He has sentimental attachment to the #2 and raced much longer then I have. For me, the # & sponsor decals were cheap & easy to apply. The decals color quality however was very poor. I feel extremely proud to race along side (or behind) many of the founding EMRA Exec (and old farts). Just racing in this class is a huge accomplishment in its self. Glen didn't have a #2 on his bike this season but we all new for damn sure he was the returning Int. SBK Champ by his talent. At the end of the day, its the respect of my fellow competitors I value most. Single digits do have a certain prestige in my opinion having grown up watching Motocross and GP. However, I would not loose sleep over running a two digit number.

I will add that it would have been awesome to hose campaign all over Scott and Travis on top the final RD6 podium. I grew up watching it on TV and always wanted to do it! Looks like fun! Campaign is cheap and the memories are life long...
 
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DEFBOY35

Well-Known Member
I would personally like to see qualifying for all classes for those of us that can't make it to every round.

The number 2 for int champ doesnt make sense to me. The champ didn't finish second, he finished first. The 600 champ and many other Champs don't get a special number. Including the winner of expert 600. I think tosh should get to keep his number without feeling guilty about it.
Perhaps you are onto something and we need to refocus this conversation to be the expert 600sbk champion running it in the future if the number becomes available.

From what I remember the scoring system doesn't seem to like having more than one of any given number. I.e. Black 1 and blue 1. It just sees 1
 

Goatse

Active Member
Great idea about the champagne Ray. It's examples like that which I'm referring to. I'm sure it was a pretty big deal to you when you won the championship, and you are right that the memories last forever. I'll be sure to bring it up to the executive next year for the final round.

The number 2 for int champ doesnt make sense to me. The champ didn't finish second, he finished first. The 600 champ and many other Champs don't get a special number. Including the winner of expert 600. I think tosh should get to keep his number without feeling guilty about it.

It's a moot point because Tosh wants to keep his number, but to clarify where it came from, if you watch any form of motorcycle racing, you'll see that in the majority of them the top few numbers are reserved for those who have placed in the championship of the premier class the year prior. Both of the SBK races are the premiere races of Intermediate and Expert. I think reserving the top 3 for the top 3 (like in many organizations) is a bit much in club racing, but a compromise would be to only have 2 reserved numbers. 1 for each of the SBK champs in Int and Exp. Running yet 'another' number 1 (since there are already 2) would be confusing, so my suggestion was the black #2.

I'm open ears to any suggestion on how to recognize the Int champ in a way similar to the Exp champ (so that it makes sense in future years with the club). This is NOT about stripping Tosh of his number, hence why my suggestion said it was full on based on his acceptance. Nobody is trying to push it forward either, so I don't know where you're getting this guilt thing from. This is a discussion thread.. Discussing the suggestions is exactly what we're doing. These are not votes, and Tosh has no chance of losing his number just because we are discussing it.

Some people are attached to their numbers, some are not. Some just pick what's available. Tosh is attached to his, so it ends there. If Tosh was not attached to his, then the suggestion would be entered. Tosh IS attached to the #2, so it will NOT be submitting my suggestion/proposal for the AGM.
 
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Dave86

Active Member
From what I remember the scoring system doesn't seem to like having more than one of any given number. I.e. Black 1 and blue 1. It just sees 1
That was only an issue with the speedhive live timing app, among other problems which is why we didn't keep using it. Not an issue with RaceHero.
 

Framer

Member
I'm open ears to any suggestion on how to recognize the Int champ in a way similar to the Exp champ (so that it makes sense in future years with the club). This is NOT about stripping Tosh of his number, hence why my suggestion said it was full on based on his acceptance. Nobody is trying to push it forward either, so I don't know where you're getting this guilt thing from. This is a discussion thread.. Discussing the suggestions is exactly what we're doing. These are not votes, and Tosh has no chance of losing his number just because we are discussing it.

This is just a thought. I see that black number 12 is available. We could make that be the Int. SBK Champs number with the 1 a bigger digit than the 2. So a black 1 with a subscript 2. And according to the riders directory, black 12 is available so no one would have to give up a number.
 
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