Open Sportbike T2 Red Flag Event

Discussion in 'Open Forum' started by cyclecrazy, Aug 15, 2011.

  1. cyclecrazy

    cyclecrazy Member

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    I am sure we have all heard about it, some even may know if judgement has been passed.

    I am interested in the details of the crash, what took place imeadiately after, and how the EMRA Club feels.

    I am unaware of anything like this happening before so this is a chance for the whole club to voice opinions.

    I have raced with Cory for 3 years and feel he has been a great competitor, and very helpful around the track. I am still not sure who else was involved so lets find out.

    Lets keep our comments clean and meaningful.

    Dave Thorne #21
     
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2011
  2. sand.man

    sand.man Well-Known Member

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    I personally couldn't believe what I saw from the stands and was surprised when I realised who it was. I don't know Cory well, but I have been around him in the pits and he comes off as a friendly guy much like every other single member in the club.

    Intentional physical contact, in my opinion, definitely has no place in the club.

    People make mistakes in racing, and as a result others do suffer as well be it in broken bike parts, lost points for DNF or injury... But it's (hopefully) always unintentional, and that's racing.

    I didn't see how the initial incident happened, but in Cory's defense I understand how adrenaline and emotion can overwhelm better judgement and hope that his actions were a case of such.

    Ryan Martin #54
     
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2011
  3. M87

    M87 Active Member

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    From my vantage point, behind the incident, a rider was trying to overtake a couple of bikes on the inside entering turn 2.
    Either he had some sort of mechanical problem or misjudged his braking point by several yards. At any rate he appeared to be on the rumble strips with his left foot off the peg. About 3 or 4 yards from the apex he was still up right and traveling south east.
    He continued south east into the stream of riders that were already in the turn striking Cory's bike.
    At that point I got a little busy and did not see anything else.
    If you want to reconstruct the chain of events that is my view of how the accident happened.
    I am also putting my name on this.
    I think if you want to ask who did what, anyone who has an opinion or made an observation should do the same.
    Michael Cormier
     
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2011
  4. Planepower

    Planepower Active Member

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    I only saw the aftermath (bikes down, and 1 rider laying motionless).
    I believe Cory to be a great competitor, and a fellow positive pit-member. The best thing I can say about Cory is that I feel totally safe on the track around him. His actions (only heard thru second-hand info) were unsportsmanlike, but I can see his point of view. I am also a person who has to get up and go to work Monday - Friday. This is club level racing and everyone should feel safe on the track, and not worry about dodging bullets. Granted, mistakes and accidents happen on occasion. I've seen a few over my years racing and volunteering(ghost bikes, t-bone impacts, high altitude acrobatics, yelling in the pits aftermaths) I'd like to think that as a person accumulates track experience, they become safer individuals. I've only heard rumors regarding the other rider as well. I would like to see repercussions that will benefit the club as a whole (by keeping our focus on making racing safe?) rather than singling out an individual.
    I know that by speaking with Cory he is remorseful of his actions.

    Heiko Boychuk
     
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2011
  5. Tattoo

    Tattoo Member

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    Has a official decision been made? If so what was it.

    Frank Potiuk
     
  6. Fireman

    Fireman Well-Known Member

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    This incident is still being dealt with at this time. A initial decision has been made, with further review to happen in the very near future.

    Until all of the documentation is complete, I won't comment any further. However, I would like to add that incidents such as this are taken very very seriously and need to be handled with great care to ensure that this behavior does not become apart of the club in which hosts so many great people.

    The executive will do our absolute best to keep the EMRA a place where we can ride and race without fear of bullying or physical intimidation. It will continue to be a place where friends come to ride together in a safe environment.

    Justin Knapik
    Vice president
    EMRA
     
  7. BrianP

    BrianP New Member

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  8. YZF1000jon

    YZF1000jon Well-Known Member

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    Does anyone have any further video from that incident?
     
  9. Ryno

    Ryno Active Member

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    I'm fairly new to the club, and I am just curious if any incidents of this nature have occured in the past within the EMRA? If so, there must be some kind of precedent already set.

    I don't know Cory very well but to say hello and have a brief convo with him but I can say he looked very remorseful for his actions.
    I don't envy the executives upcoming decision.

    Colin #26 red
     
  10. turn8

    turn8 Member

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    extra footage

    i thought the helper with steve working on turn 2 had the whole thing on video from that corner station ?
     
  11. turn8

    turn8 Member

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    The only incident close to this that i can recall was a rider taken a swing (Punch) at a corner worker who was trying to help him , the rider was suspended, but we dont see him or the corner worker anymore
     
  12. Racin Jason

    Racin Jason Member

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    Nicely said Justin. I agree rider safety and security is, and should be, of the utmost importance. I think the exec handled it properly and will continue to do so.
    As someone who has been taken out and injured pretty severly due to the mistake of another rider I know how it feels but this type of incident has given the club a black eye and there is no place for this type of stuff in our club.
    I'm sure Cory has his share of regret about the incident, and Im sure he has learned a lesson about controling that initial reaction.
    I'm sure that whatever becomes of this it will be fair.

    Jason Kolmatycki
    #98
     
  13. nac.00

    nac.00 EMRA Executive Member Staff Member

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    Both rider are good friends of mine. Derek is a good friend of mine outside of racing, and Cory had lent me his CBR for the sportsman. We were all pitted together.

    As for Derek, I had setup that bike as well as his previous race bike for him. I have been somewhat of a mentor for him this year, always helping him with what he should be working on. He was feeling very comfortable on Sunday and I had told him "Remember the first lap is the most important, get ahead and open a gap". He was trying to late brake and simply ran out of room.
    Everyone has done something "in the moment" that they regret. And having someone collide into you would take a pretty good toll on your emotions especially if you rarely crash.
    Neither of the riders are upset with each other, they quickly made amends.
    I have footage of the incident. If someone could let me know how I could "crop the video" ill post it on youtube. (If there is a program that's not to hard to use let me know)

    Neil Carlson 99r
     
  14. cyclecrazy

    cyclecrazy Member

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    As a member I feel that our sportsmanship is what sets us apart from other clubs. Not just motorcyling either. There is certainly no justification for anything physical between riders after a crash. One major concern is if both are injured what more damage could be caused by such actions. There needs to be consequenses for over the top reactions.

    The other concern I have is from the Video from Brian's vantage point. I see several riders zig zagging from the exit of turn one all the way down the straight, then we see some extreme inside late braking attempts which ended badly. I think we as riders need to also call the over zealous attempts to gain positions by those who choose to outride themselves. I can think of a podium statement made by Jason after a brilliant Expert Superbike race, in relation to a few spots he thought of trying a move on Justin, he was concerned about both riders safety more than winning! "That is not how we roll!"

    Dave Thorne #21
     
  15. LegitxORxQuit

    LegitxORxQuit Member

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    I know how important it is to get out front right from the start so you don't get held up and let the others get away. When you are running the same pace as the guy ahead but 3 seconds back it is very hard. That is similar to what happened to me during round 3 but I was passing for the lead. Lucky I didn't take neil out in the process.
     
  16. Ducbert

    Ducbert Active Member

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    I am also curious of the outcome because I find myself struggling with the right response or comments, so I will think out loud.

    On one hand I do not feel anyone should be hitting someone, especially after they are down. (later over beers sure ;) a friendly smack might have been in order).

    From my understanding it is the responsibility of the passer to ensure the safety of the people he/she is passing, correct? If that holds true, Derrek broke the cardinal rule.

    Also, I would have expected that kind of move from a Novice rider, not intermediate or above.

    If he had mechanical failure or had low sided the bike into Cory, that is racing. However, from what I have read, that was not the case.

    If Cory lost Control, so did Derrek, I think both should get punished equally, Derrek could have done much worse to many more..........

    Cory only has two hands :p
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2011
  17. Racin Jason

    Racin Jason Member

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    I felt I needed to respond to this post. I am glad that both riders have made their peace with each other. Its good to hear. May I sudgest that if you are mentoring someone you be cautious what you say as a less experienced rider may misinterpret what you say.
    I used to think the first lap was crucial as well but after a rather hairy race that I made many mistakes in the first couple laps a much more experienced rider approached me and said "I didn't have to pass you I just waited for you to take yourself out. You are not going to win the race on the first lap." Afterwards I thought about it and the man was right. Maybe some of the best advise I ever received. If you think about it, if you are faster by even a tenth or two you WILL reel in the guys in front of you. Especially in the intermediate class where lap times vary quite a bit. The cream will always rise to the top. You need to finish the race to win.
    The most important lap is the last one!!!
     
  18. sand.man

    sand.man Well-Known Member

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    The wheelie lap???
     
  19. Racin Jason

    Racin Jason Member

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    No of course not. Haven't you listened at the riders meetings? Wheelies are not allowed anywhere in the facility. :D
     
  20. sand.man

    sand.man Well-Known Member

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    Oh right of course, Justin must be talking about going "Wheelie, wheelie slow" after the checkered :)
     

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