Rule Change Proposals

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mojobie

Member
YZF1000jon said:
How many bikes would there have been this year in your proposed class, just for curiosities sake?
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According to the Round 6 Results, there were 8 different riders in the Aprillia Cup this season, typically 4 riders in each round. There were 2 Ninja 250's out that I saw, myself and Wade Dickson. Other than that, there were no other small bikes out that I was aware of (i.e. Hyosung 250, CBR125, maybe some 125/250 motards?). If I had been allowed to run I certainly would have, and that would have been 1 more rider than there was (though, I never did ask if I could).

I've also noticed that the CMRA has some HP-limited classes. Perhaps that's an idea to look into as opposed to 100% spec races, unless it's like the SV Cup where the manufacturer offers contingency and such.
 
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friendlyfoe

New Member
just wondering on the kill switch being mandatory rule. Is it acceptable if i wire ignition on power to the kill switch? The switch would still function but it wouldn't be a secondary means of shutting off the ignition, it would be the primary shutoff.
 
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fast316

EMRA Executive Member
I think if you cause a red flag you should be out of the race. Right now the rules say if you bring an ambulance out on the track you cannot continue. Seems to me every time (I can only think of 2 times in 4 years) someone crashes, brings out the red flag, and makes it back into the race for the restart it ends badly. This year it happened on the double header. The race was stopped because the bike was in the middle of the track, it leaked fluid on the track causing a delay long, enough for the rider to fix his bike and get back onto the grid for the restart at the back. Once the race started he pushed too hard to make up the positions he lost and crashed again within 2 laps.

It's a small change and doesn't happen often.
 
Fireman

Fireman

Well-Known Member
friendlyfoe said:
just wondering on the kill switch being mandatory rule. Is it acceptable if i wire ignition on power to the kill switch? The switch would still function but it wouldn't be a secondary means of shutting off the ignition, it would be the primary shutoff.
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That is already legal for racing. your kill switch will fire your fuel pump, and act as a ignition kill.
 
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racing101

New Member
fireman said:
I would really like to see reinforced engine covers mandatory. We have seen small crashes shut down our track for a hour during race day, leaving a unsafe and unpredictable surface for weeks/months afterwards. For a small amount of money you can install covers (or build them )
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I agree. +1 for my vote!
 
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racing101

New Member
mojobie said:
Agreed, but that class allows the 450 motards and the 125 GP bikes, however it's unlikely that an RS125 or a Ninja 250 could keep up with them (at least not without a serious skill differential or some major modifications - I know I can't), but they're not too far off in comparison to each other.



If the point is to keep it affordable, there's not too much difference between an RS125 and a Ninja 250...as far as I can tell they're both around $5500 new - I couldn't find a North America price for the RS, all I found was on a UK site where it was ~3500GBP.

Regardless of what happens, I'm still planning on sticking with the Ninja 250 next season (not interested in moving to a bigger bike yet), but it would be nice to have competition, rather than being a 1:16+ pylon :p. If I would have known what I know now when I was buying my 250, I probably would have gotten an RS125 instead, but it's unfortunately too late for that.

Eric Swayze
#249R
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I have a well kitted RS125 for sale... nearly for what you would pay for one new... and very low KM!
 
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racing101

New Member
fast316 said:
I think if you cause a red flag you should be out of the race. Right now the rules say if you bring an ambulance out on the track you cannot continue. Seems to me every time (I can only think of 2 times in 4 years) someone crashes, brings out the red flag, and makes it back into the race for the restart it ends badly. This year it happened on the double header. The race was stopped because the bike was in the middle of the track, it leaked fluid on the track causing a delay long, enough for the rider to fix his bike and get back onto the grid for the restart at the back. Once the race started he pushed too hard to make up the positions he lost and crashed again within 2 laps.

It's a small change and doesn't happen often.
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+1 also... if you crash and ITS YOUR FAULT (especially if you take somebody else out)... you should not be allowed to race again that day. There are plenty of mediators available to support the decision, and it should not be a problem.
 
O

oldskool

Active Member
racing101 said:
+1 also... if you crash and ITS YOUR FAULT (especially if you take somebody else out)... you should not be allowed to race again that day. There are plenty of mediators available to support the decision, and it should not be a problem.
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I don't think if you crash you should have to sit out the rest of the day. Is this supposed to be a penalty or punishment for crashing? or to ensure that 'half repaired' bikes don't get back on the track?.......because really that would be up to tech to ensure, and what if you bring more than one bike out with you?

also, there are many times when at fault is very grey and far from black and white........I can't see this rule flying.
 
sv-racing-parts

sv-racing-parts

Well-Known Member
kawasaki said:
I agree with the emergency form in your leathers pocket. I do think that back protectors should be required to cover from tailbone to neckline area and have hard shell with foam padding. Beyond that specifiying a standard may force a lot of people with servicable back prtectors to buy new ones.(not me though, mine is only from tailbone to mid back and should NOT pass any tech yet WMRC, CMRA and EMRA all pass me, and I am getting a new one.)
Requiring chest protectors may be a bit much although offically reccomended may be a good addition.
Some other really good tech things that I encountered this year that would be good additions to our tech is actually testing the kill switch by running the bike at tech and using the kill switch.
And I was fit tested for my hekmet fitting properly in Calgary.
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:) Typically the higher quality race versions, like the Knox contour, have the extended tail bone coverage included at or very near the same price as the shorter version, so cost is not going be the big factor in which style buyers choose,

I can tell you the the contour style of tailbone coverage works, and is not uncomfortable. They also prevent your back from snapping backwards, resulting in some really unpleasant consequences,

I am posting up the information on the Knox group buy for Back Protectors, Chest Protectors, and the Knox Padded Shorts in Group Buys tonight,

It will help make really good equipment less expensive and easier to get for all of us,

If nothing else, the hard back protectors, and the Engine covers need to be mandatory, I can't think of a single race or track organization that I know of North America, or Europe that does not require them. In fact until this thread, I thought that we did too.

Enjoy the ride, and best regards,
Blair
 
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YZF1000jon

Well-Known Member
The reading I've done so far shows that some of the hard protectors aren't as energy absorbing (read safe) as some of the soft ones, this is where difficulties in making rules lies. Maybe just making a rule for length/coverage is the minimum we can do, especially as everyone seems to agree that separate back protectors are required.
 
sv-racing-parts

sv-racing-parts

Well-Known Member
YZF1000jon said:
The reading I've done so far shows that some of the hard protectors aren't as energy absorbing (read safe) as some of the soft ones, this is where difficulties in making rules lies. Maybe just making a rule for length/coverage is the minimum we can do, especially as everyone seems to agree that separate back protectors are required.
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:) Can you link us to the reading so that we can see which back protectors were rated the highest?

The higher quality hard back protector products like Knox and similar prodlucts are used at the highest levels of racing for a reason, they work.

Sport Bike Track Gear has some video reviews on the quality of the products available,

Enjoy the ride, and best regards,
Blair
 
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friendlyfoe

New Member
sv-racing-parts said:
:) Can you link us to the reading so that we can see which back protectors were rated the highest?

The higher quality hard back protector products like Knox and similar prodlucts are used at the highest levels of racing for a reason, they work.

Sport Bike Track Gear has some video reviews on the quality of the products available,

Enjoy the ride, and best regards,
Blair
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ride magazine did an independent test, the forcefield with its soft honeycomb got the best impact resistance of the lot, with the hard alpinestars and dainese (wave - old model) doing some of the worst.

The forcefield is CE level 2 where as many of the hards only meet CE level1. It's not going to stop you from getting folded in half, but it is one of the best at impact absorbtion, i'll find the link.

EDIT: http://www.motorcyclenews.com/upload/Ride%20Magazine/Product%20test%20pdfs/6%20JUN08%20Back%20protector%20test.pdf

and here for all of their product tests
http://www.motorcyclenews.com/Ride/Product-Tests/
 
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sv-racing-parts

sv-racing-parts

Well-Known Member
Back Protectors vs Spine Protectors,

:) Hi, you are right, Forcefield does have good products, no doubt, but they tend to sit flat and do not bend to follow the body lines, nor do they offer the protection to the shoulder blades that back protectors like the Knox products do.

The head of Knox, Jeff Terval, is on the CE Board in England and Knox had the first CE Certified products, years ago, so you know Knox is all about the safety,

Both the top level Forcefield Pro, and the Knox Contour, along with the other Knox products we recommend are CE Level 2 certified, Level 2 is the higher certification above Level one,

One of the other differentiating features of the Knox products is that they are much lighter in weight, better fit, and more comfortable to wear as they are designed to work with the body shape,

Bottom line is that there are lots of products out there that range from good better, and best,

What we all need to be doing as club riders is to be using one, to keep ourselves whole in the event of a crash,

Click here to read about the Knox Contour,
http://stores.sportbiketrackgear.com/Detail.bok?no=424
http://stores.sportbiketrackgear.com/images/InitialSet/contourcutout.jpg

Click on the video at the bottom of the pager to see the video review,

Enjoy the ride, and best regards,
Blair
 
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solo

solo

Member
fireman said:
I would really like to see reinforced engine covers mandatory. We have seen small crashes shut down our track for a hour during race day, leaving a unsafe and unpredictable surface for weeks/months afterwards. For a small amount of money you can install covers (or build them )
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It's pretty hard to find engine protection covers for an old bike, On the old F2 about the only thing that could cause a leak from a damaged engine cover would be the left side mag cover, since I went through the trouble of making my own race fairings, the lower that normally has a hole in it so the mag cover can stick out, was built up to cover the mag cover and reinforced with carbon/kevlar, would that be considered enough protection on that side of the engine?
 
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Dean

Active Member
The WMRC requires them on all bikes except Motards, regardless of age. Older bikes just get them made. These are acceptable for us:

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you can easily make something like this. Others have fashioned types of frame sliders as well made of delryn that work too. One bike had over 16 sliders on various locations that we counted to ensure that their engine covers would not hit.
 
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